Keith Gooden
Welcome back to the Motorhome Matt podcast. I’m Keith Gooden.
Matt Sims
And I’m Motorhome Matt.
Keith Gooden
And today we’re talking about the law changes with regard to towing vehicles. It was changed about 18 months ago and Matt’s going to give us an update on that one. It’s all brought to you with www.thatleisureshop.com. Welcome along.
Last-minute motorhome hire bookings
Keith Gooden
Let’s get stuck straight into the news, shall we Matt? There are some last minute bookings in the hire book.
Matt Sims
Well, we’ve got some gaps. We’ve got some lulls in the hire diary.
Keith Gooden
Have you got lulls?
Matt Sims
We’re doing the lull thing again.
Keith Gooden
Have you got that bike riding swan still?
Matt Sims
The peddling swan! You’ll have to listen to previous episodes to know what we’re going on about. Yeah, the hire team at Motorhome Holiday Company have got some gaps. So if you’re thinking of a motorhome holiday this summer, then get in touch with the team because we’ve got some gaps.
We’ve got an offer of 15% off on all our two berth motorhomes this summer. So if you’re thinking of a quick escape for a few days, we’ve also dropped our minimum hire of a week so you can squeeze a little trip away into our diary, into our lull.
Keith Gooden
Just the two of you.
Matt Sims
Well, we’ve got six berths as well.
Keith Gooden
Yeah, but the 15% off is not for them.
Matt Sims
No, no, it’s only for couples. There’s always a deal, Keith. Always a deal. Talk to Nikki. Bend her arm.
New at That Leisure Shop: Maypole Wireless Reversing Camera
Keith Gooden
Okay, then. Let’s talk about what’s new in the shop your favourite product for this week.
Matt Sims
This week, yeah, we had a wireless reversing camera arrive from Maypole. And they’re brilliant. They’re really low priced. They’re actually really good. I’ve always been very cynical about wireless reversing camer thinking the signal would break up.
But this is designed for caravanners. So there’s little plate you can bond to the back of the caravan and then have the screen plugged into your cigarette lighter, or the 12 volt accessory socket.
Keith Gooden
That’s the one. People don’t have cigarette lighters anymore.
Matt Sims
Let’s call it a cigarette lighter.
Keith Gooden
12 volt accessory socket.
Matt Sims
You told me off last time I called it a cigarette lighter. It is a cigarette lighter.
Keith Gooden
When was the last time you saw somebody sparking up a cigarette?
Matt Sims
The other day, actually.
Keith Gooden
In a motorhome?
Matt Sims
No. On the street. But anyway, you plug the camera in there and you’ve got a reversing camera, which on the back of a caravan is genius.
Keith Gooden
Do you do it on your phone?
Matt Sims
No, it’s got its own little screen, so it’s a self-contained unit. And it’s really, really good. The picture quality was great. The signal didn’t break up. We have this exhibition trailer that we take to the shows and I was using it on the back of that. And it just makes reversing it really easy, really handy. Top product.
What are the towing law changes?
Keith Gooden
It’s the Motorhome Matt podcast. I’m Keith Gooden. And I’m Motorhome Matt.
Matt Sims
And I’m Motorhome Matt.
Keith Gooden
And into the main part of today’s podcast. The law was changed 18 months ago with regard to towing.
Matt Sims
It was, yeah.
Keith Gooden
What was that change? And what will the effects be?
Matt Sims
So in their wisdom in November, or actually September 2021, the government decided in a very short space of time – the consultation was really short, a few weeks – to drop the B+E restriction on our licences. So it used to be the case that you passed your car driving test and you were restricted on how much you could tow – 750 kilos.
Then if you wanted to drive anything over three and a half tonnes, you took a test to get the C1 licence. That is still the case. That licence is under review. That restriction is currently under review. Since we left Europe, the government is currently considering whether to give us back that entitlement to drive over three and a half tonnes.
But the B+E was dropped, meaning you could pass your test, drive a car up to three and a half tonnes and tow a trailer up to three and a half tonnes. So you could have a train weight of seven tonnes, but you could still only drive a vehicle up to three and a half tonnes. You couldn’t drive a lorry weighing seven and a half tonnes.
Keith Gooden
So you can have a vehicle of three and a half tonnes and a trailer of three and a half tonnes, but not a vehicle which is completely powered, i.e., not a trailer up to seven tonnes.
Matt Sims
Yeah, and this was 18 months ago. There were huge protests from the driving training industry that there would be loads of accidents and it would be a disaster. So I thought well, 18 months on seems a good timeframe to go and find out what the impact has been on driving standards and on the driver training industry of this change. So I spoke to a friend of ours, Sharon Sparkes, at Mendip Towing Training. They’re based very close to here. And this is the living that Sharon has, this is her business, driver training.
What are the impacts of the towing rule changes 18 months on?
Sharon Sparkes
The DVSA and the government bodies that have brought in this new ruling have not thought of the impact this is going to have on road safety at all.
Matt Sims
And what impact has it actually had?
Sharon Sparkes
A tremendous impact. You know, if you drive around the countryside, which I do because I live in the countryside, you’ve only got to meet somebody who’s pulling their caravan behind them, and they can’t go back. They can’t go back because they don’t know how to reverse.
But the worst side of it, I think, other than reversing, which is an embarrassment for the person involved, is the fact that they might not have coupled that vehicle up properly. And that’s going to have an impact on pulling out even onto a main road.
Matt Sims
We see this often where we are in our office. Behind us there’s a caravan storage business. And at the moment, probably once a week, people pull out onto the road, and the caravan leaves the car. The brakes are applied automatically. And it’s just a mess.
Sharon Sparkes
Yeah. I mean, there’s a simple method when you take the training. It’s called a stress test. Out of 100 people, if I said, “Have you conducted your stress test on that jockey wheel?” They would look at me vacantly. They wouldn’t know what I was talking about.
What is a jockey wheel stress test?
Matt Sims
Go on, then, tell us – what’s a stress test on a jockey wheel?
Sharon Sparkes
Okay, the stress test is once you’ve used the jockey wheel to put the hitch onto the ball, you then must wind it back up lifting the back end of your vehicle, which is weighted, obviously, to a stress point where you’re satisfied that it hasn’t come off the ball.
It’s no good going along, and just saying yeah, that’s okay, I’ve lifted it, using your hands. You’re not strong enough. And if that hitch is not on that ball correctly, certainly a stress test will reveal that. Wind the jockey wheel up so that it’s connected to the vehicle and it’s lifting the back end of the vehicle.
What do driving instructors think about the law change?
Matt Sims
So it’s trying to force it off the tow hitch. So I just want to give you a scenario, right? Okay, so we’ve got a motorhome that weighs three and a half tonnes, it’s 7.4 metres long, and we go to shows with a box trailer. So we’ve just purchased this great big trailer, and it’s probably six metres long. And it has a gross weight of two and a half tonnes.
The motorhome can tow that. It’s within the capability of the motorhome to tow that. But just for clarity, my colleague Jordan, who’s in his early 20s, has a normal car licence. He doesn’t have a C1. So he’s passed his test very recently. He can now drive that, can’t he?
Sharon Sparkes
Yes, he can. Yeah, he’s legally allowed to drive that vehicle.
Matt Sims
What’s your view on that?
Sharon Sparkes
It’s crazy. It’s crazy. He’s got no experience. He’s just passed his test. So like you say, he’s passed his test in a Mini. He’s now getting into the likes of a Range Rover or a motorhome. He’s never been taught to reverse. He’s never been taught to couple up properly. He’s now got the extended length, which will equal my artic lorry that I teach in, which is 14 and a half metres.
Matt Sims
And it’s interesting, the rules about length of vehicles. He can drive a vehicle that’s rigid up to 12 metres long and three and a half tonnes. But he can also on top of that tow a trailer that’s up to three and a half tonne and seven metres long. That’s 19 metres plus the A frame as the maximum, but then he needs an escort. So there is a cap, isn’t there, of a 16 and a half metre length before you need an escort. But you can drive that on a car licence.
Sharon Sparkes
He hasn’t got to go and have a medical. He hasn’t got to do an extended theory like you have to if you go into the realms of HGV and LGV. He’s done none of that. He’s just literally said he’s fit to drive on his B licence when he applied for his licence. And he’s taken no further education in it at all.
Matt Sims
He can’t drive a motorhome, though, that’s over three and a half tonnes. He has to have a C1 to do that. And that just seems insane to me, that rigid seven metre motorhome or seven and a half metre motorhome or even shorter that’s 3,650kg – he can’t drive it. That just seems a bit odd.
Sharon Sparkes
They’ve got to have a cutoff point on weight, and that’s the cutoff point. So then they move into the next category, which is your C1.
The upcoming C1 entitlement review in Parliament
Matt Sims
So the C1 licence entitlement is only available without a further test to those of us who took our tests before 1997. To have a C1, you have to take another test. But this is under consultation with Parliament at the moment. And lifting it means that our motorhomes can be slightly heavier and have bigger payloads, and I think safer. We’re not going to be overweight. But do you think Parliament is going to going to lift this?
Sharon Sparkes
No.
Matt Sims
No? Why not?
Sharon Sparkes
I don’t know why not. But if it was going to happen, it would have happened already.
Matt Sims
It’s taken some time, hasn’t it? It has been months already in Parliament, much longer than the B+E restriction being lifted.
Sharon Sparkes
It’s been there for a good year.
Matt Sims
And you think that’s a clue that it’s just going into the long grass?
Sharon Sparkes
It’s just going to be put on the backburner unless something comes forward in the near future. But they’ve got to the 24th of September to make a decision on it.
Matt Sims
So what happens on the 24th of September this year?
Sharon Sparkes
The evidence has to come forward as to why it was proposed in the first place.
Matt Sims
Okay, so we’ll wait until the end of September, then, to find out the answer to this.
Sharon Sparkes
Yeah, you need to.
Matt Sims
So I’m a fan of it being lifted, but you’re not, obviously.
Sharon Sparkes
No, I’m not. No, because I just think, again, you’ve got a guy that’s passed his test in a Mini and he can now drive an incredible length and weight. He’s not upping it to seven and a half tonnes. He can up it to a lot more, depending on the vehicles he’s driving.
Mandatory towing training
Matt Sims
I get that. Surely, though, is there not a case for some sort of middle ground where there’s some training and there’s a cap? Is that a possibility?
Sharon Sparkes
Yeah, training is a possibility. To bring that in, to implement that, they’re going to have to change a lot of law and legislation and they just don’t want to do it.
Matt Sims
Yeah, it won’t happen, will it? We were talking earlier about compulsory basic training for motorbike test. You were saying that this is something that car drivers should get in order to drive a lorry.
Sharon Sparkes
If you want to go to the C1, or even the B+E, why couldn’t we just have a qualified instructor signing off that element of training? At least they’ve had training, even if they don’t go to test, but make it compulsory that that training has to take place.
Matt Sims
And do you think that some sort of compulsory basic training should be imposed for those looking to tow a caravan?
Sharon Sparkes
Yes, absolutely, definitely. And I think it would save a lot of the accident stats. It would just totally, because people who turn up here and do the training at the moment, they haven’t got a clue. Not a clue of what they’re doing.
The reasons for the towing law change
Matt Sims
Now, there was big resistance to this change when it was initially proposed in September 2021. And it became law a couple of months later. I think it was November 2021. You and your industry, the driver training industry, the police, the fire brigade, a whole load of organisations were opposing the change. Grant Shapps, who at the time was Minister for Transport, didn’t really have an answer as to why it was being changed.
Sharon Sparkes
Not at all. He couldn’t answer any question. When I went to a consultation meeting, I said, “What has changed for you to bring this element of destruction to our industry?” And he couldn’t answer it. I said, “The roads are only getting more busy and more dangerous. Why would you take away a safety element that’s been introduced 23 years ago?”
Matt Sims
And what did he say?
Sharon Sparkes
He didn’t. He just deflected it onto something else.
Matt Sims
And so why do you think they did lift it? My understanding was it was something to do with the route to HGV driving, but actually, there’s a backstory there, isn’t there? It’s about the examiners.
Sharon Sparkes
Yeah, it was the examiners, to release examiners back into the industry to be able to cover more tests for the HGV. But what they didn’t know was the fact that a lot of the B+E examiners weren’t qualified in HGV anyway, so they just went back to car testing.
Matt Sims
And you’ve got the statistics on this. Was it 180 B+E examiners in the UK?
Sharon Sparkes
I can’t say exactly how many it was, but it was in the hundreds. Yes.
Matt Sims
And how many actually went on to do the HGV testing?
Sharon Sparkes
Approximately 60.
Matt Sims
So a third. So would you say it was a bit of a pointless exercise?
Sharon Sparkes
Absolutely a totally pointless exercise from that point of view. But the biggest worry is the fact that it’s taken away a safety element of our roads. People are at risk now.
Has there been an increase in accidents?
Matt Sims
There was a big claim that accidents would increase. I mean, last week, a caravan flipped over on the M5 just locally to us here. Is there any evidence that there are more accidents happening as a result of this?
Sharon Sparkes
We won’t have those stats available to us for some time yet. But they’re going to have to bring some stats forward by the 24th of September if they’re going to convince us that it doesn’t need to be reintroduced.
Matt Sims
Sharon, what’s been the impact of all this change for you and your business? What does the future hold?
Sharon Sparkes
Okay, so for me personally, I covered B+E training all the time. I didn’t do anything else because it was so busy. I had a six-month waiting list of bookings ahead of me for people to come in and do the training and the test. The industry and my personal lifestyle was taken away from me within two weeks. I was given two weeks’ notice.
So I lost my job with no compensation or anything. So I’ve had to turn to HGV training, which I’ve done in the past anyway, yeah, going out buying lorries and stuff like that to stay in the industry. And the future? I see the future is very dismal with the DVSA. They’re going backwards. They’re not going forwards in road safety.
Matt Sims
And if someone wants to get training to drive their caravan just for their own sanity, is that a good idea? Can they approach you for that?
Sharon Sparkes
Absolutely. Yeah, we run two-hour and three-hour courses. It’s bespoke. We fit it to what the client needs. And we cover every aspect of the driver training for a very small fee. So they get a certificate of competence at the end of it because I’m an approved driving instructor and have been for the last 42 years. So I give them a certificate of competence, which is backed by the DVSA to say they’ve come up to a reasonable standard to be able to take to the road with their caravan.
Matt Sims
And it gives people the confidence to do it as well, doesn’t it?
Sharon Sparkes
Yeah, absolutely.
Find out more about Mendip Towing Training
Matt Sims
And where can people find out more about you and your business, Sharon?
Sharon Sparkes
I’m Mendip Towing Training/LGV training. I’m on the internet under Mendip Towing Training. Look at the reviews. They say everything.
Should people take training despite the law change?
Keith Gooden
That’s Sharon Sparkes, driving instructor from Mendip Towing Training. The question I’ve got for you after that, Matt, is do you recommend that people take the training anyway?
Matt Sims
Oh, absolutely. Yeah, I think it’s a really, really sensible idea. As I said in the conversation with Sharon, we see caravans falling off the back of cars here. Where we’re recording this there’s a caravan storage business behind us and people don’t hitch them on properly. It’s really easy to get it wrong. And if you don’t know what you’re doing, you can have an accident.
You could do yourself a serious injury. In fact, in our own storage business, we had a customer who just bought a caravan and he dropped the caravan off the tow hitch so it went down to the floor and then had the challenge of trying to raise that a frame back up using the jockey wheel. He ended up using a jack so lift it back up.
And he just got it wrong because it was naivety on his part. So I was able to give him a little bit of training and show him how to use it. We’ve got a colleague here who is going to be towing our exhibition trailer. And we will be doing the jockey wheel stress test with him, and making sure that he has an hour with me reversing and driving and towing that trailer. Really important.
Keith Gooden
Let me play devil’s advocate here. You’ve got YouTube. I mean, Motorhome Matt’s all over YouTube. Surely watching a couple of videos will give you enough training that you can go out and do it yourself?
Matt Sims
Yeah, you could do. That’s a good place to start. But there’s nothing quite like having someone watching what you’re doing and then monitoring when you’re getting it wrong and putting you on the right path, is there?
Keith Gooden
You’d mentioned before we introduced Sharon that when the law was changed, some of the towing industry said we were going to see an increase in accidents. Have we seen that at all?
Matt Sims
I have to say, I’m not seeing more accidents being reported on the motorway than usual. Probably once a month a caravan flips itself over on the motorway here at the M5. It’s quite commonplace, and we get a lot of caravans through the summer.
We’ll see what happens over the coming weeks, when thousands and thousands of caravans every week all head south and north back up the M5. But honestly, I don’t think we will. I think cars have become better at towing. Caravans have certainly become more stable when they’re being towed. Hitches have become massively improved in terms of stability, and the technology in towing has improved. So I’m intrigued. I do wonder.
I take Sharon’s points on board and her concerns about driving standards. And I think they’ve dropped across the board. Mobile phone use whilst you’re driving is a new thing, isn’t it? That’s happened in recent years, and we’ve had to legislate against that to stop us doing it. But are there more accidents from caravan towing with people with this new licence? I’m not sure.
Keith Gooden
Right. And you say that standards have dropped across the board but of course, the driving test in this country is one of the toughest in the world to pass, isn’t it?
Matt Sims
Yeah, it is. Yeah, in fact, Sharon and I were joking off mic about some countries where you literally drive forward and reverse and pass. That’s Israel, she was saying, making a comparison to the UK test. I thought it was interesting what she said about compulsory basic training as well for someone to tow a caravan, or even to drive something bigger.
Driving a big motorhome is very different to driving a Mini. It is very different. And we see people off on their holidays every day here who are hiring a motorhome and they’ve left their tiny car here. And they’ve got into a three and a half tonne motorhome. And actually our accident rate is really, really low. The reality is that people are sitting up high, they’re relaxed, they’re not racing to a meeting, they’re going on holiday. They are in a different mindset.
And they have a £1,000 excess to think about. And I’m sure that’s a motivator as well. But generally, people feel they are more in control of the environment they’re driving in, so the motorhome itself and of the road, and are taking their time. So you’d think we lose bumpers every other hire. We don’t. The odd wing mirror gets hit and occasionally a rear corner gets knocked and cracked. But it really is not very often that that happens.
Keith Gooden
With the rise of the SUV, the vehicles that we’re using to tow trailers and caravans with, are more up to the job than they used to be. You used to see Hillman Imps and stuff towing caravans. You don’t see that anymore!
Matt Sims
No, you get that phrase, the tail wagging the dog. And the capability of vehicles has of course gone up. And yeah, this is a topic with EVs. Their ability to tow is greatly restricted. But yeah, cars and motorhomes can tow significant weights.
Keith Gooden
Is it time for when you buy that caravan or motorhome brand new that they roll the training into the retail price? It’s not an option?
Matt Sims
That’s a valid point. I think you’d see resistance from dealers to do that. And I think you’d see resistance from the consumer to do that, actually. I don’t know that it should be compulsory. I think it would be a very sensible thing to do. It’s a difficult one, isn’t it? Our freedom now is to be able to just do it, and we would be taking that away if there was compulsory training introduced.
Keith Gooden
Okay, then – whatever you have got to say on this we really want to hear. How do people press that button and get their question to us?
Matt Sims
Yeah, certainly. Go to www.motorhomatt.co.uk/askmatt. You can hit the orange button and record your question or fill in the form and submit it there. And when you’re recording your question, please tell us where you are. We love to know where the podcast is reaching.
Keith Gooden
We absolutely do. We want to hear your towing stories, successes, failures, and also your opinion about the behaviour of people on the road and perhaps the ways we can make things safer for everybody.
Audience Q&A
Chris Howard’s positive AA experience
Keith Gooden
It’s the Motorhome Matt Podcast. I’m Keith Gooden.
Matt Sims
And I’m Motorhome Matt.
Keith Gooden
And it’s brought to you with www.thatleisureshop.com. Right, now – my favourite part of every podcast, the Q&A, where you get to ask Matt the questions. First of all, Chris Howard got in touch.
Chris Howard
Hi, Matt. Hi, Keith. My name is Chris. I’m a fairly new campervan owner. I’ve had mine for a couple of years now. But I’ve still got lots to learn. And I’m really enjoying listening to the podcast and learning lots of lots. It was also nice to meet Matt recently at the Newbury show. I had nice chat with you there, Matt. So thank you for that as well.
You were asking on a recent episode about people’s experiences with different breakdown services, so I thought I’d share my experience. I live in Surrey, and I was travelling to Ben Nevis. And I planned to stop over in the Lake District on the way, in Kendall overnight to break up the journey. So the next morning, I set off and within about 10 minutes the engine sound suddenly changed from being normal diesel engine sounds to being really loud.
So I knew there was something not quite right, so I pulled over and I thought, well, I can either ring the AA, because I have AA cover through my insurance from Safeguard. But I assumed they would just tow me home, so I thought, I’ll tell you what I’ll do. I’ll try a couple of local garages just to see if they would be able to sort me out.
Anyway, I tried that and unfortunately, all the garages nearby were fully booked and didn’t have any time to look at the campervan. So I found a lay-by and and rang the AA. I got a phone call back fairly quickly from the local chap, Tom. He had look underneath and fairly quickly diagnosed the problem as being that the exhaust system had sheared off where it joined the manifold, so it was clearly a bit of a problem.
Like I say, I assumed I would just be getting towed home and that would be the end of my trip, but actually Tom said, “I might be able to fix it.” He had quite a lot of local contacts. He made a few phone calls and he managed to find a supplier not too far away that had a replacement part, and Tom fitted it and I was on my way.
So from being quite dejected and thinking I was going to be going home on the back of an AA van, I was actually on my way and I managed to make it up to Scotland. I was very happy. That was a positive experience for me. I just thought I’d share that, and hopefully that was of interest!
Keith Gooden
Cheers, Chris. Much appreciated. Matt, what do you make of Chris Howard’s question?
Matt Sims
It was more a story, really, than a question!
Keith Gooden
His life story!
Matt Sims
Big tick to the AA. Well done, yellow guys once again. I mean, they have a huge number of roadside breakdowns that are fixed at the roadside, and they get people on their way. That’s their number one priority, as I’m sure it is for all the breakdown services.
Of course, Chris has listened to my recent tale of woe, where I was waiting for 15 and a half hours in a broken down Alpha Romeo in the dark and the cold for the RAC. It was a bit of a disaster.
If you’ve not seen it, go and watch it on YouTube or listen to it on the podcast and all over social media. I was there actually posting live from the car. And I was genuinely frightened. In fact, their solution, the RAC solution was for me to call 999 and get the boys in blue out.
Keith Gooden
Have a listen to that podcast. The RAC have put things right, we must add. Thanks very much, Chris, for getting in touch. Much appreciated and thanks for saying such nice things about the podcast.
Mark Hayward: “How can I tow with an electric camper?”
Keith Gooden
Mark Hayward is in Bristol. He says, “I can’t tow with an electric car. So how could I tow with an electric camper? How many sites would have the electric capacity to provide charging hookups? Not many.” Well, we know there are not many at the moment, Matt. Let’s spool forward five or 10 years, and that might change, mightn’t it?
Matt Sims
I think it’s definitely going to change. And Mark, what I think what you’re doing here is trying to make a demand of a product that just can’t deliver it yet.
Keith Gooden
It hasn’t been invented yet.
Matt Sims
No, it doesn’t exist. And you can tow with electric car and the towing capability of electric cars is vastly improving this year, and it will next year as well. So that’s changing. Towing with an electric camper – well, electric campers, some exist. The ID Buzz – some people are having a go at converting it. CampervanCo have made one as well, all electric with a really good range, I have to say, about 200 miles. So it’s happening.
What the towing capability of that is, I don’t know. Probably not very much. I think it’s going to change, but we just aren’t ready for this demand yet. Charging on campsites at the moment – very, very few have got EV charge points. And it’s going to be years before that rolls out.
I’d say, Mark, go and listen to some previous episodes, very recent ones, where we talked to an expert on the National Grid and how he sees the future for our electrical infrastructure and how campsites are going to receive electricity closer to them than we might have already. So yeah, I would go and check that out.
Keith Gooden
Thanks very much for the question there, Mark.
Colin Coulthard: What is the speed limit of my motorhome?
Keith Gooden
Colin Coulthard’s in Harrow. I recognise that name. He’s asked a question before. He’s got a question and a half here. “Following your comments about speed limits, I was looking for speed limits for three and a half to seven and a half tonne motorhomes. The government website refers to a 3.05 tonne, not 3.50. Is this a typo?”
He then added this question. “I just noticed that it’s unladen weight. Does this add another aspect to payload? I saw a three and a half tonne motorhome quoting a payload load of 295 kilogrammes, making unladen weight 3,205 kilogrammes. What speed can they drive at?” My brain is like spaghetti.
Matt Sims
It’s complicated. So basically, speed limits are determined by the kerb weight, the net weight of the vehicle, so before it’s got any load in it. So most motorhomes are under 3,050 kg. That’s the threshold. That’s the speed limit determinator. Is that a word? A determinator.
Keith Gooden
Yeah, yeah… “I’ll be back.”
Matt Sims
But the key thing here is if your payload is only 295 kilos, then you’re over that. So yeah, you have a different speed restriction imposed on you. So the speed limits are typically 30, 60, 70 and 70. So 30 in a built up area, 60 on a single carriageway, 70 on a dual carriageway and 70 on a motorway.
However, if your net weight is over 3,050, so like the motor home that Colin alludes to, it’s 30 in a built up area, 50 on a single carriageway, 60 on a dual carriageway and 60 on the motorway. But how would a police officer know?
So the only indication the police officer has when they stop you, if they stop you, is that they can pop the bonnet and look at your gross weight, which is probably 3,500, irrespective of your net weight. They’re all generally 3,500. If you’re over that, then you’re going to have a payload over the 3,050 probably, so they can guess you’re probably speeding if you are.
But how do they know? The only way to find out is to empty the motorhome and go and weigh it. Well, that’s not going to happen. So this is often something that people say, “Ah, it’ll be fine,” about. But I would say, drive within the capability of the vehicle and your own ability as well. You know what the net weight is. Be mindful of that. The motorhome is built for those speeds, so just be careful.
Keith Gooden
Be very careful. There can be spot checks, can’t there, on weight and they take you onto weighbridges. It does happen. There’s one on M4 at Junction 18 at Bath, a weighbridge. They concentrate on lorries, but you never know – it just might not be your lucky day.
Matt Sims
Well, there are some campaigns by VOSA to stop motorhomes and caravans especially, and they check the weight. But in my experience, and I’ve been stopped, they only check the gross weight. They don’t ask you to empty out your pants and socks in your shoes and everything else and all your hats and weigh it then empty. I’ve never known them do that.
Keith Gooden
Excuse me, sir, would you mind emptying out your pants and socks?
Matt Sims
It’s a question you get regularly asked, Keith, I’m sure. I’ve never known that to happen. I’ve never seen someone with all their personal belongings in bags on the side of the road while they drive the motorhome onto a weighbridge. So maybe you’ve had that experience. Maybe you’ve been asked to totally empty the motorhome.
But even then, what criteria is in that net weight of the vehicle when it was purchased? Did it include water, how much fuel is in it? It’s normally 90%, but what about the driver? How much weight is allocated to the driver? So a whole load of questions. So it’s a threshold that has to be imposed. There has to be a line in the sand, doesn’t there, of how fast you can go. Over this weight, this is how fast you can go. In reality, is it going to ever be detected? Probably not.
Keith Gooden
So I hope you got from that answer everything you wanted from your question, Colin. As far as I was concerned, my brain turned to mush as soon as I got to the end of your question, but I hope Matt has been able to put you right.
Get in touch with Matt and Keith
Keith Gooden
Thanks for listening to the Motorhome Matt podcast. What should people do to get in touch, then, Matt?
Matt Sims
You can. We would love it if you did go to www.motorhomematt.co.uk/askmatt. And there you can ask your question – just click the orange button. Tell us your name and where you are in the country or fill in the form and submit your question that way. On the website you will also find all the previous episodes and a whole load more information too. You’ll find us on YouTube at Motorhome Matt and also Facebook, Instagram, and TikTok.
Keith Gooden
TikTok, TikTok. Share with a friend as well, if you can. And if people listen on Apple and Spotify, what should they do, Matt?
Matt Sims
Oh, please do share with a friend and leave a review. If you can leave us a five star review on Apple Podcasts or Spotify if that’s where you’re listening, we would love that. It helps spread the word of the podcast and affects something called an algorithm.
