Keith Gooden
Outjoyment, outjoyment, outjoyment! Welcome to the Motorhome Matt podcast. I’m Keith Gooden.
Matt Sims
And I’m Motorhome Matt.
Keith Gooden
It’s Friday at the NEC in Birmingham for the Motorhome and Caravan Show 2022. What a great atmosphere, Matt.
Matt Sims
The show’s just opened. It’s really busy. It’s a sold out day and very exciting. We’re sat on a beautiful stand. We’re at the Camping and Caravanning Club stand. This is gorgeous. It’s lovely, isn’t it?
Keith Gooden
It’s fantastic. And we’re going to be hearing from Simon in just a few moments about some really exciting research that they just published yesterday. And stay tuned, you’re really going to love this. It says a lot about the sort of people motorhomers and caravanners are.
But first of all, we were out and about before the show opened asking you what you thought of your pastime. Motorhoming – does it make you happy? And if it does, why?
Why do you enjoy motorhoming?
Visitor 3
We’re very new to it. We’ve only just bought a campervan less than two months ago. So it’s something that we’ve talked about doing for a while but never been in the position to do it. We’ve been on one trip so far for a weekend. We really enjoyed it. We both love going out walking because we’ve got a little Labrador. So again, it fits us to go out in the van. And the dog gets to get a good walk. So yes, we’re very happy with it.
Keith Gooden
Research now proves that campers are happy! Motorhoming and caravanning is good for your mental health. When you were out for that first time, what was the feeling that swept over you?
Visitor 3
It was just relaxing because obviously, we had freedom. We woke up in the morning, it was nice and quiet in the fresh air and we were away from the everyday grind. Not getting up every day to get to work.
Keith Gooden
How does it make you feel when you go motorhoming?
Visitor 4
The same really. Yes, happy. I like to be out in the outdoors with the fresh air and not cooped up in town.
Keith Gooden
And what about the future? Are you going to go further afield?
Visitor 4
Well, we’re going to try and go up to Scotland at some point, I think. We’ll do the North Coast 500. So yes, just explore and then hopefully once we get used to it we might explore France.
Keith Gooden
New research out yesterday says that Motorhoming and Caravanning makes people happy. It’s proven by research now. Do you motorhome?
Visitor 5
Yes we do. We love it. And it definitely is the best way to get about.
Keith Gooden
So what’s the best thing about it?
Visitor 5
It’s just a home from home and you just completely relax when you’re out and about, and you’ve got nothing to distract you. No distractions, just fresh air, walks, mountains, beaches and everything. Brilliant.
Keith Gooden
Have you come far to the show today?
Visitor 5
Yes, we have come from Northern Ireland. We flew in this morning at 7am and we’re back out at 10pm, so it’s a long day.
Keith Gooden
New research says that happy campers really are happy campers. It’s proven now by universities in Sheffield and Liverpool. What’s your name first?
Cyrille
Cyrille.
Keith Gooden
Cyrille, where have you come from today?
Cyrille
North Yorkshire.
Keith Gooden
Is it a special trip?
Cyrille
Yes, definitely. We’re stopping at the Travelodge at Solihull. We’ve come here for last night and tonight. It’s the freedom. It’s the excitement of planning where you’re going to go. It’s just being able to do what you want when you want, to stop when you want and to go when you want. It’s brilliant. It does make you happy. We wave to each other on the roads as we pass. So yes, we are happy people.
Tamara Woods
I’m Tamara Woods.
Keith Gooden
Have you made a special journey today?
Tamara Woods
Yes, we flew from Belfast this morning at 6:50am.
Keith Gooden
Are you a motorhomer?
Tamara Woods
No, but we would like one. We’re at the very beginning of our journey of looking.
Keith Gooden
What is it about motorhoming and caravanning that attracts you, then?
Tamara Woods
We started out in the pandemic. Well, we cycle. My husband’s a big cyclist. I’m a Driving Miss Daisy cyclist. We bought kayaks. We now have enough kayaks for six people. We’re quite outdoorsy people and we work during the week but at the weekends we would be quite outdoorsy.
Keith Gooden
New research says that motorhomers and caravanners really are happier people. It’s proven by two universities, Sheffield and Liverpool. What do you think of those findings?
Visitor 6
It’s probably very true. I would say it’s quite true.
Keith Gooden
I mean, you haven’t even got the motorhome yet and you’re smiling.
The Camping and Caravanning Club’s involvement in The Outjoyment Report
Matt Sims
What a lot of happy campers! Absolutely brilliant. Now, Keith, I have to say we’re here with Simon McGrath, a very dear friend of mine. Hello Simon. How are you?
Simon McGrath
Hello. It’s great to see you guys. Yeah. Welcome to the club stand.
Matt Sims
You’re very much part of the fabric of the club.
Simon McGrath
14 years now. I don’t see it as a job half the time. It is a vocation. I love it. And I love the industry.
Matt Sims
We love you too. You are fantastic and a huge ambassador for the club. Now, tell us about this report. This has been a long time coming. And a long time in the brewing, hasn’t it? Tell us more.
Simon McGrath
Oh, absolutely. And it’s really exciting. It’s called The Outjoyment Report and actually, you can take this back 11 years when we first published a report called The Real Richness Report. Now, that looked at how camping and the outdoors impacted and benefited people’s health and well-being. And obviously, we’ve been through a tough few years.
And really, we wanted to build on the success of that first report a decade later. And so we’ve signed up our academic friends at Liverpool John Moores University and Sheffield Hallam University, and they are truly experts in their fields.
And we’ve pulled together The Outjoyment Report, which really does look at health and well-being and the benefits that you get from being in the countryside and camping, especially in all its forms. That could be in a motorhome, campervan, trailer tent, tent, you name it, but what it really does for you and our academic partners have just been so good at actually truly understanding what it’s all about.
Matt Sims
So is this basically applying the science to the phrase we love, ‘Happy campers,’?
Simon McGrath
Absolutely. And I think, Matt, we all know that it’s great for you, but what this does, and this is the really exciting part, is it truly evidences what benefits we get, how it can help us, how it can improve our health and well-being.
And I think that’s so important, because we’ll be using that to engage with policymakers or decision makers at government level to try and influence really positive social and health outcomes using this. And so it’s hugely exciting. It’s not just about a really interesting piece that the media might find interesting, but it will go much, much deeper than that.
Matt Sims
And the health benefits have been proven in this report. I mean, the results are overwhelming, aren’t they? I mean, you must have been cheering and jumping up and down when you saw the results.
Simon McGrath
Absolutely. I think the credentials of the report speak for themselves. We really want to spread the word about the word, ‘Outjoyment,’ itself. I don’t know whether you ever do a crossword Matt, but it’s called a portmanteau word. It’s a blend and we love the way outjoyment sums up the outdoor enjoyment that you can get from it.
Because just imagine in terms of that word itself, if you’re glamping, glamorous camping, enjoying your brunch, breakfast and lunch, talking about Brexit, we won’t go there. That’s what it’s all about.
And so in a couple of years’ time if we’re chatting again, if we’re talking about it, I would love to say everyone’s using it and it’s now going to go in the Oxford English Dictionary. That would be wonderful. That would be one of the other outcomes among many that were really positive and enthusiastic about.
Matt Sims
I was also wondering last night who came up with the word. You came up with it, didn’t you, I’m guessing?
Simon McGrath
I would so love to take ownership. It was a really talented copywriter that we work with. He’s just a wonderful wordsmith and he came up and he said, ‘It’s a bit left field, this one.’ And as soon as I saw it, I let it soak in for about 10 minutes and then I was like, ‘I love it.’ It took a bit of selling around the club, and it was wonderful. Everyone was like, ‘Okay, let’s go for it.’
Matt Sims
Dr. Adele was one of the scientists behind the report, and we got to ask her a bit more about what was involved in doing the research.
The findings of The Outjoyment Report
Keith Gooden
It’s Dr. Adele Doran. Where are you from, Dr. Adele?
Dr. Adele Doran
I’m from Sheffield Hallam University and I’m a principal lecturer in tourism management there.
Keith Gooden
And you’re here because Sheffield Hallam University and Liverpool John Moores University have got together with the Camping and Caravanning club to bring out what’s called The Outjoyment Report. So it’s true there is such a thing as a happy camper.
Dr. Adele Doran
There is such a thing. Yes, there is such a thing as a happy camper. And happiness is actually quite a complex term. So people say, ‘Happy,’ but actually, it’s to do with someone’s outlook on life, if they have really good life satisfaction, they have good relationships with others, and they just genuinely feel quite positive about their life in general.
So yes, happiness was a key motivator for our camping responses and I think it was 97 or 98% of our campers said camping makes them happy.
Keith Gooden
So this report, is it fair to say, proves that being outdoors and being part of the motorhome and caravan community is good for your mental health?
Dr. Adele Doran
Yes, it does. Absolutely unbelievably so. I’m an outdoor participant, I go camping, I have a campervan. I love going camping and doing things outdoors. So to me, it was a no brainer. People are obviously going to be happy being outside but the findings definitely show that.
So our findings show that campers have better well-being and are more likely to be flourishing and have optimal mental health and less stress and are just less anxious and more relaxed than non-campers. They’re also more connected to nature as well. We use the scale called the nature connection index, which is one that Natural England use as well.
And we found that our campers are more connected to nature than the general UK population, but also than the non-campers in our survey as well. But what’s really interesting is the more you camp, the better your well-being is. So actually you have greater well-being across all dimensions, whether that’s emotions, social well-being, psychological well being.
However, in terms of being connected to nature, it wasn’t actually the frequency of camping that improved that. So you’re just as likely to be connected to nature if you go camping one or two times a year as opposed to six plus times a year.
The impact of The Outjoyment Report
Matt Sims
Candy is one of the writers and test editor for the Camping and Caravanning Club. Candy, I’d love to know what your view is on this report and what it means for the press and for the industry. And what can we do to get behind it?
Candy Evans
Well, I’ve been thinking about this, really, in the last 24 hours having been so involved in the actual writing of it in the first place. And as I was coming over, I was thinking it’s actually a much, much bigger story than our industry. Women’s wellness magazines, that is the thing that comes to mind for me. We’ve had a lot of talk about the menopause recently.
How many people are thinking, ‘Actually, a great way of relaxing is to get out into the outdoors,’? And that’s the sort of thing I’m thinking. How can we change the angle of what we’re saying so that we’re not just preaching to the converted?
Matt Sims
No, that’s right.
Candy Evans
And schools are a really strong thing for me. There are so many people I know, and my husband is one of them, who went on an outward bound course. He went when he was a kid. And that’s what got him into the outdoors.
Matt Sims
I bet he still talks about it as well.
Candy Evans
He does.
Matt Sims
And that’s the magic, isn’t it? I mean, we were saying earlier that kids carry the memories of a camping holiday in that rotten caravan 30 or 40 years ago. We carry that memory into our adulthood, and it changes and morphs our future, doesn’t it? And very positively. You never hear anyone say, ‘Oh, we used to go camping as a family. I hated it.’
Candy Evans
I do, actually. To be honest, I do. But then it’s about giving people that opportunity. If you’ve got a class of 30 kids, there’s going to be an awful lot of them that will go on that camping thing and say, ‘I never want to do it again.’ But if you’ve got half a dozen of them for whom it lights a spark, then you have changed their lives.
And if they never have that opportunity-, it’s fine if people don’t like it. I don’t have a problem with that, really. And of course, the people that we meet with are all the people who’ve done that.
Matt Sims
How can we get behind it? What can we do to really raise awareness of the report and get it out of our industry into the wider UK and beyond? And how can we educate people that this report exists?
Candy Evans
That’s a big question. I suppose on an individual basis, personally, I’m thinking of our local schools. Because in Warwickshire there has been an outward bound centre which my husband went to a horribly large number of years ago, and they’re talking about closing it. Now, we can actually use these figures as part of the argument to say, ‘Well, let’s keep it open because it could change some of these youngsters’ lives.’
Keith Gooden
You were saying it’s a much bigger story, actually, than just motorhoming and caravanning and the pastime, and you’re right because the menopause, mental health generally for men and for women, is an issue now which people are paying more attention to. And even though people who take part in this pastime have known the benefits, this research underlines it and proves to the sceptics, everybody else, that they really should be taking part, shouldn’t they?
Candy Evans
Yes. And what I particularly like about this is that it has been done completely independently. Yes, the Camping and Caravanning Club has obviously supported it and funded it but they’ve been very careful, the academics, to make sure that the club doesn’t have any say in what the results are, which I think is really important.
Keith Gooden
We have to underline this is not a report produced commercially so you can use it commercially. This is true science.
Candy Evans
Yes, absolutely. And when you look back at the Real Richness Report that was done in 2011, there was some great stuff in that, but psychology and things have moved on such a long way and we understand so much more about how to measure these things. And so the measurements are against nationally recognised measures so we can use this in places where nobody’s interested in the marketing of camping and caravanning at all which I think is good.
Keith Gooden
Where are you from, Margaret?
Margaret
We’re from North Lincolnshire. We’re staying for the week at Meriden and we’re coming over two days so we can cover more.
Keith Gooden
Now, you’re the first through the door on Friday.
Margaret
I am! We were at the ready in the wheelchair. It’s a race!
Keith Gooden
Do you have a motorhome or caravan?
Margaret
A caravan.
Keith Gooden
A new survey that came out yesterday supported by Sheffield and Liverpool universities proves caravanners and motorhomers are happier people than the rest of the population. What do you think of that?
Margaret
I agree, I agree. We just love it. It’s a whole different way of life. Freedom, relaxation, exploring, meeting great people – it’s an excuse to come somewhere like this and meet lovely people like you.
What difference can the report make?
Keith Gooden
What are you going to do with this information? What practical difference is this going to make?
Simon McGrath
Well, we’re hoping early next year to talk to the government and MPs, but also certain departments – hopefully, the Department of Health and the Department of Digital Culture, Media and Sport. They’re responsible for tourism.
There are also lots of tourists bodies, Keith, that we really want to engage with and share the report findings with so that we can actually start a debate and get discussion going as to how you can use camping in all its different forms to actually get people outside to get to improve the mental health of the nation and the physical health as well, especially for young people.
Young people are really suffering at the minute. We want to get more people and kids engaged through camping at schools and so on. There’s a whole load of depth to this report. But it’s really exciting. And we really hope that the right people at the right levels will really engage with us on that.
Keith Gooden
And this report actually breaks a few taboos, doesn’t it? Everybody thinks, and if you look around this show, it’s not true, we know that, that motorhoming and caravanning is for retirees and for older people only. It’s much more exciting than that. But this report really underlines that fact, doesn’t it? And as you say, you can get younger people involved because now you can prove that it’s good for your well being!
Simon McGrath
Absolutely, we can evidence it. And what the report finds as well is that actually, people are much more likely to continue really good activities and so on. If you start a youngster on a-, say if they enjoy kayaking, or cycling, you get them involved in their early years, and a great way to do that is through camping and spending time outdoors, they will carry that forward with them.
What the report also shows is that people being connected to nature much more is a much healthier place to be. And I think you’re also much more likely to care for the environment in turn. So there’s lots of wins with it. And we just are still really trying to understand the depth of what we’ve published. But it’s great.
Matt Sims
I read the report with huge interest as a parent of four children, three of them still teenagers. They’re all in their rooms whenever they can be looking at a screen. And it made me feel a responsibility as a parent to ensure that they engage with what we know is a great activity – getting outside and getting close to nature.
And certainly I was thinking about it last night thinking, ‘I’ve got a responsibility to do that.’ I know that, but reading the report, you can see the benefits. And if you’re listening to this and you are a parent, I would encourage you to listen to the report, go and read the report and find out more about it. Where can people read the report Simon?
Simon McGrath
Well, if you head online, you can go to www.theoutjoymentreport.co.uk. There you’ll find the full academic report, and also a nice summary called an impact report. There’ll be a bit more information around it too, and also a link to the previous report from 11 years ago, which is interesting as a way of comparing it.
Matt Sims
How long did this report take to put together, Adele?
Dr. Adele Doran
It was about a year in the process. So we really spent quite a lot of time thinking about the psychological well-being scales that we wanted to use. So we identified six really robust, internationally recognised scales. But what that meant was that it did actually give us a lot of data. So the analysis did take some time. And we also had nearly 16,000 respondents as well. So once we cleaned the data we were left with 11,000 responses, which is just absolutely significant. It’s a huge sample.
Matt Sims
And there was an interesting statistic within the data, wasn’t there, in terms of ethnic origin. Can you tell us a bit about that?
Dr. Adele Doran
This is what we’d like to do next when looking at the data in a little bit more detail. We’re really pleased. I appreciate that 11,000 is still a lot of people, but we actually had over 350 respondents who identified as non-white, so they’re from an ethnic minority group. And what I would really like to do now is look at their data in a little bit more detail.
Because whether it’s camping or any outdoor activity, minority ethnic groups are underrepresented, and it’s really important to understand what is preventing them from going outdoors, or if they are going outdoors and camping in particular, why do they love it so much?
So in terms of going forward, I’d really love to do some more qualitative research so you can actually speak to people and really get to the nitty gritty of what makes them go camping, what motivates them and what might be a barrier.
Matt Sims
So we are all happy campers. Where do we go now with this report? What’s the next step?
Dr. Adele Doran
So for me and Kaye, who are the researchers, we’d like to look at the data in a little bit more detail. We got so much data and we used six really, really internationally robust scales. So we need to drill down at that data a little bit more. And we’d like to also speak to people in person to understand the ins and outs of their experiences in more detail to really illustrate our key findings.
But from a camping and caravanning point of view and from an industry point of view, what we want to do is use the findings now to really inform discussion and encourage people to look at camping as an opportunity for social prescribing, green prescribing, so you know, to address maybe some mental health issues through camping and prescribe it, but also to get it more on the agenda for the education agenda.
So we know that being outdoors and camping activities can really improve young people’s mental health. It can make them more connected to their education. It can help them develop resilience and their character.
If they can experience that at a young age and then they can go into adulthood with those experiences and continue camping as adults, then it’s really important for their well-being and for our nation’s well being, really.
Matt Sims
All of us have memories. We have memories of camping holidays as children, and they’re always the memories we hold dear in adulthood, aren’t they? We don’t remember necessarily the holiday to Corfu. We talk about that wet holiday in Cornwall. It’s odd. And we see this in our customers all the time. But tell me, is it that happy people go camping, or does camping make people happy?
Dr. Adele Doran
I think that’s a really good question. So we know that happiness is quite nuanced in that it’s not just about people being happy, it’s how they perceive their life. It’s how they feel about their social interactions, if they get on really well with other people, that they feel a sense of belonging in their community and their jobs and in their careers. So I think it’s a mixture.
I think happy people will go camping but I think camping and the outdoors makes people happy. So I think it gives people the opportunity to rebalance, reflect, take time out, just work out what’s good about life. Just making a brew, sitting outside. The sun’s just rising, the sky’s clear, you’re hearing the wildlife, and it makes you really connect with nature and appreciate what’s good in life.
Keith Gooden
Dr. Adele Doran, thank you very much. That’s The Outjoyment Report if you want to look it up, brought to you with the Camping and Caravanning Club, Liverpool John Moores University and Sheffield Hallam University.
Visitor thoughts on the report
Sarah Gill
Sarah Gill, Harrogate.
Keith Gooden
I understand you are a Motorhome Matt listener.
Sarah Gill
We love listening to the podcasts. When we’re driving along we have a half hour journey, so we put a podcast on. It’s great.
Keith Gooden
A survey came out yesterday from the Caravan Club saying motorhomers and caravanners, officially now because it’s been backed up by Sheffield and Liverpool universities, are happier than the average person because they motorhome and caravan. So what is it about motorhoming or caravanning that you like?
Sarah Gill
When I was a child, as a family, we had a VW caravanette and I just always remember those fantastic family holidays of going away for three or four weeks during the summer. And it’s just fantastic to be able to recreate those memories.
Mike Gill
Mike Gill. It’s the freedom to get outdoors, really. We can put our bikes in the back and just go and visit different places without the hassle of booking hotels or any other sort of hassle like that. We haven’t actually got a motorhome yet. We’ve got the torture of the delivery delays.
So hopefully, touch wood, we’ll be getting it in November. So we’ve only done a couple of trips. The Forest of Dean was a nice place to go. We like the forestry places where you can hire a mountain bike and walk and just generally get away from things.
Sarah Gill
We have on order an Adria. And yes, it’s been an order for a while but we now have a chassis number and a registration number. So the date is November, fingers crossed.
Mike Gill
It’s like slow torture coming here and looking at all these motorhomes when we haven’t actually got ours yet but yes, hopefully soon!
Keith Gooden
So it’s true. And research proves it! Motorhomers and caravanners really are happy campers. This is an amazing report, isn’t it Matt?
Matt Sims
As I say, Simon must have been hollering around the office, because we all know this to be true. We know it’s great for your mental health. We know it’s good for your well-being. I always say to people going away in a motorhome does something to you. You go away for a weekend, you come back and you feel like you’ve been away for a week. I’m a workaholic. I’m busy, busy, busy all the time. And I meet customers who are the same and they don’t stop.
They’re staring at their phone, an iPad or computer. They’re on the phone and life is busy. And they go away in a motorhome and something on that trip makes you just switch off. I’ve always said I sleep better in a motorhome than anywhere else. As I say, it does something really magical. And if you’ve never done a trip in a motorhome or caravan before, I would encourage you to do it. It’s a really special thing and there’s science behind this that proves it and backs up this rhetoric that I’m constantly spouting. It evidences what we know to be true. It’s fantastic.
Keith Gooden
Thanks for listening to another Motorhome Matt podcast with me, Keith Gooden, and of course the big expert, Motorhome Matt Sims himself. Well, let’s point people towards your website shall we, if they want to listen to more and see more about what we have been doing at the show.
Matt Sims
You can find out everything we’re up to at www.motorhomematt.co.uk. And from there you can tune in to the podcast audio or video. On YouTube it’s Motorhome Matt as well. And if you’ve got a question make sure you head to www.motorhomematt.co.uk/askmatt and get the question to us on audio or simply fill in the form. We’d love to hear from you.
